S2 EP1-Mindy Green-Homeschooling Myths Debunked: Why Kids Thrive Outside Traditional Classrooms

Herb: 00:00:20

Today I have the pleasure of introducing Mindy Green. Parenting can't be that hard. Before kids, she had thought she had the whole parenting thing figured out.

In part due to her background as a school social worker. Her four kids showed her quickly how much she had to learn.

With her strong willed oldest child leading the charge, parenting quickly became her ultimate crash course in flexibility, patience and connection. No degree or training could have prepared her for the real life lessons they brought into her world.

Today as a parenting coach, she draws on those hard earned experiences to help parents of school age children, especially tweens and teens, navigate their child's growing independence.

Using the tools like disc personality assessment, she guides parents to better understand their kids unique personalities and the power struggles that can come with them.

Together, she navigates the inevitable challenges of parenting to create a strong foundation and relationships that thrive even during the most challenging years.

Mindy Green is here to help you tackle the ups and downs of parenting with a little more ease, a lot of empathy, and the occasional well deserved laugh. Thank you very much for being here, Mindy. It is going to be a pleasure talking to you.

There's a lot of things that I really like in your bio that I want to touch on. So welcome to our show.

Mindy Green: 00:01:37

Thank you. I'm so excited to be here with you all.

Kristina: 00:01:41

You know, it's one of those things that when as we are connecting with different coaches and different things like that, the different tools that are brought in that can be used to help families is just so amazing. And I'm glad that we have an expert, someone who knows about this assessment and things that will really help our families.

And I love that you're focusing kind of on those teens and tweens because we've been kind of bouncing back and forth on our podcast between the youngers and the olders and the in betweens. And so, so thank you for being here today and sharing some of this.

Mindy Green: 00:02:08

Of course. I'm like, as I said, I'm excited to be here and to talk about, you know, the things that, that sometimes we don't want to talk about as parents.

And those are the things that make us feel bad or we're a little bit ashamed of or feel guilty that we're not getting it or we think that at least we're not getting it right.

Kristina: 00:02:26

Yeah, and that's the thing. We think we aren't getting it right.

But as long as we're doing our absolute best and communicating with our kids and really, really trying, we're probably getting it a lot more right than we think we are.

Mindy Green: 00:02:38

Absolutely. I agree with that. Yes. We're hard on ourselves.

Kristina: 00:02:42

We are, absolutely. So you have four kiddos, and they have been your inspiration and your drive to do more about this learning and figuring out how to coach parents?

Mindy Green: 00:02:53

Yes, they. I do have four kids, and it's hard for me to say this, and I. It gives me a little twinge, but they're all grown now.

You know, My youngest is 23, and my oldest is 29. And so we were. We were going through. We home. I homeschooled for 18 years, and, you know, I had a child graduating every other year.

And so that was our life, you know, for what, eight years. And it was just really, it's a busy time. There's lots of change and transition and. And come with that comes their own personalities.

And I'm like, you know, it's easy for me to think, okay, when we first started homeschooling, I really wanted to do like, one and done figure it out for one. And then they all do it. And that's not realistic. But I was holding on to that for a period of time, and then it was just.

I'm going to be honest, it was a disaster. So I had to change the way that I was looking at them because they are individual. You know, they have their own personality traits. They have their.

The way that they learn best. And I was like, darn it, this doesn't fit in to the way I wanted it to be. But then that's when I realized it wasn't about me.

Herb: 00:04:02

So did your children ever go to a public school? You said 18 years, but there's 12 years of schooling. And so that sounds like straight in.

So you were a social worker in school, you were in the school system. Why did you choose to. From the start, it sounds like, keep your kids at home and do it yourself instead of take them to work with you.

Mindy Green: 00:04:26

You know, there are a couple of things that happened along the way, and as a. As a school social worker, I was seeing what was going on with the kids in school. And, you know, there was just.

Especially for those kids who maybe learned a different way. And I was seeing them being left behind, and it wasn't because the school wasn't trying or anything like that, but it was.

They really are looking at educating the masses. And so sometimes kids can. Can be left behind. They can be overlooked. And. And I didn't want that for my kids. I wanted them to be able to have this.

This chance. Even though I. As what I said earlier, I wanted to Figure it out for one and then have all of them be like that. So I was in that mindset too.

But what really drove, drove me to keep them at home was that I wanted them to have the ability to love, to learn, and to do it in the way that best fit them. And so I had to deconstruct my view of education too, which is what I did in those very beginning years.

And yeah, so that's really one of the reasons why I wanted to keep them at home is to give them the opportunity to explore the world.

And, you know, I wanted to be able to go on field trips and I wanted to do all of these things to open up the world to them and not just feel like they had to get something from a book.

Herb: 00:05:48

So were you full time at school when you started working with your children?

Mindy Green: 00:05:52

I was.

And then I, I was pregnant with my fourth and I was like, I just can't do this anymore because I had three kids, five and under, and expecting my fourth, and I was like, I just, it was too much. So I, I came home from work and then, you know, I, I've been at home ever since.

Herb: 00:06:09

So you were, you weren't actually homeschooling while you were, while you were being the counselor, you, you left that to be the homeschool parent?

Mindy Green: 00:06:18

I did, yes, because I, I had a little bit of overlap with kindergarten for my oldest daughter. So I was, I was doing that as well as homeschooling her, but it was just for like two or three months because I just realized I couldn't do that.

Herb: 00:06:33

Kind of like, wow, Christina was a teacher. It's like, how did you do that with four kids when at the time where we had two, it's like, we couldn't have done that with two.

So, so okay, you left the school system. Good. So now we don't have to feel so bad because she was working.

Mindy Green: 00:06:52

No, please don't. Yes, because I only had to do that for like two months. And then I realized that this wasn't going to work if I was, if I was working full time.

But I know parents and I've, I've, you know, mentored parents who have, you know, they've been working full time jobs and then they've also been homeschooling. And I just, my hat's off to them because it's not easy.

Kristina: 00:07:12

Yeah, but it's possible.

Herb: 00:07:13

It is possible.

Mindy Green: 00:07:14

It is possible. And they, they prove that, you know, and they, they're very heart centered and very connected to their kids and kudos. To them for doing it.

Kristina: 00:07:24

Yeah, I absolutely love that. Yeah. Because that's one of the questions that I do get as well as like, but I have to work. How am I going to do this?

I mean, part of the, the blessing, the silver lining of that thing that happened a few years ago was that people did figure out how to work at home or have a hybrid kind of work so they are more home with their kids and things like that. So that was a blessing in disguise for a lot of families.

Herb: 00:07:47

And also that homeschooling doesn't have to be seven in the morning till three in the afternoon. You can have your schooling in the evening because there's a lot of kids who actually learn better in the even were talking about personality.

So, yeah, some kids are not morning kids. Dragging them out of bed and sending them to school is not a good thing.

And then in the afternoon, they come alive and they blossom during the afternoon. So, you know, that's one of the things that we talk about, is how individualized the children are.

And to individualize their education isn't really that difficult.

Mindy Green: 00:08:15

Right. And I'll be honest with you, as an adult, I'm not a morning person.

And so, so it was hard for me to think that I needed to be doing this from like 8, 8 to 4 or 8 to 3 or whatever the time period was. And so we, we did show, we did have a lot of flexibility and in our schooling. And it was, you know, partly was because that fit me best as well.

And, you know, so being able to figure that out and figure out how my kids best learned was really a blessing for all of us.

Kristina: 00:08:47

Yeah, that's one thing I wanted to touch on because you did say, you know, oh, I thought I was going to figure out, and then this one model would work for all four kids kind of thing. And it really does go back to those learning styles, you know, that different kids learn differently. They need different ways of interacting.

It's not that you only want to teach in that style because they need the experiences, but, you know, you want to reach them where they are as much as possible. So that is a stumbling block.

And I'm glad you, you know, you were figuring it out and you're encouraging other parents how to figure that out as well.

Mindy Green: 00:09:18

Well, and I think what happened too is I brought certain expectations, not even from schooling, but from, you know, from other people that I met in the homeschooling community and they would talk about, because I'm such a researcher. So before I even started homeschooling, I had read all the books that were available.

I had talked to several people, either in my church or in the homeschool community that I joined a couple of groups before I even started homeschooling, because I wanted to find out, what is this all about, what am I getting into, and can I actually do it? And so it was really helpful to have those conversations, but I was taking things from them and thinking this was going to work in my family.

And, you know, one of the parents I met, and I remember she was just very vivacious and really engaging, and she came and she did a whole session at a group meeting that I had, and she was talking about how she teaches her kids with games. And so, you know, they would learn math through that, and they would learn, you know, just some of those basic, wonderful skills.

And even, like, she did this with reading comprehension. And. And so I tried that, and I realized I don't like games. So it's going to be hard to use this as the.

As the foundational block of our homeschooling, because that just wasn't me.

Kristina: 00:10:40

Yeah.

Herb: 00:10:41

Yeah, that's really interesting as well, because different learning teaching styles show up in homeschooling, too.

And, you know, another one of these myths is that people think that homeschool has to be like, the six to eight hours a day like we were talking about. And so they try and bring school home. They try and replicate what happens at school at home.

And you kind of talked about how you were trying to do that as, like, put all of your kids and to have them do the same kind of a thing. And once you get the kids home, you realize real quickly that that just doesn't work. There's.

Mindy Green: 00:11:15

Right.

Herb: 00:11:16

And there are so many more effective ways.

And the next thing you talked about was getting your kids to love learning, because once they get that love learning and they get out of that school model, then they start pulling what they want to learn, and they use their passions and what they're having fun with to bring learning to them. It's like, oh, wow, this is a lot of fun. And then they start learning how to do that, and that brings in other learning opportunities. So it's.

It's not. So it's not replicating school at home, which in the early days of homeschooling, people really tried to do.

And there's still a lot of that out there, like with homeschool pods, where they send the kids to different pods for several. Several hours a day and try and replicate school in different people's homes. Kind of a way.

So there's lots of different ways to do it, but finding that individualness of the children and. And drawing on their strengths really, really helps a lot.

Mindy Green: 00:12:15

Absolutely.

And I was just thinking, as you were saying, that one of the things that we found is, you know, my third child, my oldest son really has an interest in politics and, you know, and he. And also just in history. And so he created in high school, I think he was a sophomore in high school.

He came to me one day and he said, I want to learn all about the European royal families. And so he came, and so he showed me the books that he wanted to use, what he was going to do.

And so we came up with this whole course, and it was really based on his interest in figuring out, like, how the royal families of Europe are. Are connected and, you know, their lineage. And so it was really.

I learned a lot going through it, and I was really learning from him, and that was from his enthusiasm about something that I wouldn't have even thought about, you know, and was that a traditional course that they would teach in high school? Obviously not. Right. But he. He really put together something that was. That was very comprehensive. And.

And to this day, he'll go back and say, you know, remember when we talked about whatever at this point? I don't remember, but I'm like, oh, yeah. But that was something that. It stuck with him.

And then he put together another course his junior year, and that was all around, you know, the history of politics in the United States. And so it was just incredible. And again, I learned so much, and I learned that from him. And something that was really of interest.

Kristina: 00:13:49

To him that is awesome and amazing because. Yeah. I mean, even though it's not a regular course in our American schools, they. He still learns so much.

Not only just research skills, writing skills, putting things together, all of those kinds of things, but now he has a knowledge of the world that a lot of people don't have, that he can go and talk to different people about and be interesting and. And things. So that is wonderful.

Herb: 00:14:14

So. Oh, you go.

Mindy Green: 00:14:15

Okay.

Kristina: 00:14:15

I was gonna say, because one of the things that we also kind of hear lots of times is like, how do you do four kids at once? Once, One or two. Absolutely. That's easy to do. But four kids, what was the key for you?

How did you figure out how to do four kids at once in their learning?

Mindy Green: 00:14:32

So that was, I think, partly where initially I wanted everybody to kind of do the same thing. So. And that. And. And I realized early on that we weren't able to do that. We had a curriculum that we would all come together and we would know.

We would have read alouds, and then they would have readers, and so we would do the read alouds together, and we would do history together. And I found that a little bit overwhelming. Not a little bit. It was overwhelming.

And so that's when I decided, okay, so we're going to have to separate things out a little bit. So what I did do is I would have them start out. We would start out with one activity, and that would warm us up for the day. And then I would get.

Get them started. So there. I knew that there were certain things that they could get started on their own. And so for the.

So I would work with one of them, and we would work with, like, with my oldest daughter, we would start with math, and then with the others, like, it might be that they were doing something that was. That they could do on their own, they could do independently.

And then I would switch throughout, and then I would give them the individualized attention to get them started on that next subject where they needed more help. And then. And then we. I would just rotate through.

And I do want to go back to what I think Herb had said about, like, that you don't need to do this for six, seven, eight hours a day.

And really what I found is, especially for my younger kiddos, that when they were like, kindergarten, first, second grade, really, we were doing about an hour of, you know, of. Of work. And then. Because. And then the rest of the time, what were they doing? They were. They were playing, they were. They were reading.

They were doing different things. That. And we would. That's when we would do our trips. You know, we might be going on a field trip, things like that.

And then we would talk about it in the car. And even though it was just a conversation, what I was learning from them is what did they retain, what was of interest to them?

So they were presenting. You know, they were. They were doing these presentation skills. They were. You know, they were identifying with.

For instance, we live close to Williamsburg. So they were able to talk about some of the history and, you know, and. And really go through that.

And then we would tie that into something maybe we read. And, you know, so it's. It's very rich and it's very fluid.

So it's not, you know, so sometimes when we were reading in our language arts also tied into history or into science, and, you know, we did a lot of things like that. And for science, for instance, we would Keep. The kids would keep nature journals and that was something that we could do together.

Herb: 00:17:12

Yeah.

Mindy Green: 00:17:13

You know, so we would take walks in the neighborhood and you know, we would pick up leaves.

And one year they were really into birding and so we had a bird book and so they would, we would look at the different birds that we had in our backyard and what types of food did they eat, what types of seeds and how long do they stay and you know what, where their nesting was. So we would use observations like that to really enhance whatever we were doing.

Kristina: 00:17:40

Absolutely, yes.

And you know, if you think about it as, you know, even classroom teachers, they love it on field trip days because they get to take the classroom learning outside of the classroom and apply it to the real world and things like that. So think about that.

It's like you were saying, you can do that every day or every week because that's what your child, children are interested in and it ties in. And you as you as the parent, you know what they've been learning. So you know how to tie it in. You're like, oh yeah, we just learned about this.

How does it connect to this? And just that daily life and learning and connecting it all.

Herb: 00:18:12

Yeah. And the learning outside of the school, of the watching the birds, what do they eat, where do they nest, when do they leave?

Those kind of questions that, that keeps the kids learning outside of the school time. Because it's like, oh, hey look that, that bird's there. They'd be out playing. It's like, oh, hey look, it's eating that.

So it keeps bringing them back to these learning opportunities throughout the day. And it, and it makes them lifelong learners instead of school time learners.

Mindy Green: 00:18:40

Exactly.

And even trips to the grocery store, you know, we're looking at putting a meal together and looking at, at learning how to read labels, all of those things. You know, that's health, that's science, that's. It can be math. You know, so you're doing so much and it's.

And you know, even they would help me make dinners and so that, you know, that's learning how to read a, read a recipe and figure out, you know, sometimes we didn't have all the ingredients. Is there something that we can substitute? And it's just there's such a wealth there and we don't.

It doesn't have to look like school for them to learn.

Kristina: 00:19:21

Absolutely.

And that's the big mindset shift that a lot of parents need to kind of move into and move away from whenever they're thinking, oh, how can I do this thing called education at home or home education. Have you noticed a shift in terminology away from homeschool?

Mindy Green: 00:19:40

Yes, it, you know, I see. And that seems to be something newer, you know, that we're like, you know, we're educators.

And I think it's because it's trying to bring some of that is bringing in, validating, you know, the experiences that they have at home. And so.

And also I see, you know, a number of the homeschoolers in my area now what they're doing is they're naming their schools, you know, so it's like, you know, so something Academy. Like mine was Aderman Academy. And you know, and so that, and then. So that is something that I think is newer that I'm noticing.

Kristina: 00:20:22

Yeah, yeah.

Herb: 00:20:22

That's why we call it education at home and not homeschooling, because it's like, it's not, it's not really anymore.

Kristina: 00:20:28

Yeah.

Herb: 00:20:29

And parents. Christina always says you're your first and your child's best teacher. They learn the most from their parents.

So, so let's go into the, into a more controversial thing. And I'm gonna, I'm going to come at this a little funny. So what about you pigeonholing your children with the disc?

Personality assessment and narrowing in who they are and how, how are you, how are you comfortable like, like setting your kids course by using a personality tool.

Mindy Green: 00:21:03

Oh, her.

Herb: 00:21:04

Wow.

Mindy Green: 00:21:04

Okay. So what I really like about the disc because I have a background in neuroscience as well, so I'm neuro, I'm neuroscience trained.

And what I was finding is developmentally, our kids go through certain stages and it looks a certain way. Right.

And so I think being able to understand how to engage the brain and to be able to understand, especially when our kids get to be tweens and teens, that their whole brain is being remodeled. And when I understood that it was, it was like a light bulb went on.

And what I was finding with that is that I needed something that was even a little bit more detailed. And so that's where the disc came in. And what I really love about DISC is that you don't. You're not just. So DISC stands for the four different.

For four different personality types. And first is the D is for dominant.

And these are the kids who are, you know, seem like the natural born leaders and can seem sometimes bossy at home or, or, or they can also question you on the decisions that you're making because they really want to have more of a say. And then I. Is for that inspiring kid. And I, I have each, I have a kid that falls into each of these and multiple.

And so, you know, that my inspiring kid. I never knew who, who all we were going to have at home.

He was like the Pied Piper, you know, because his friends would come over and you know, and just. He was, he's lots of fun. He's also impulsive, you know, so it gave me some insight into.

Instead of being so frustrated with him about his impulsivity, it's just that he really likes to connect with people so he doesn't always think things through. And so that just gave me some really good information. Then. S is supportive.

I'm not, I'm this, I'm the supportive type and I'm like, can't we all just get along? I don't like conflict. And so it's like.

But as a parent, you need to be able to step up and be the leader and say, sometimes say, you know, I love you and I still need you to do this.

Kristina: 00:24:41

Yes.

Mindy Green: 00:24:42

You know, so it gave me some insights into myself and into one of my children who is a. Very, very much an S. Very people pleasing. And then the C is cautious and they're all about the details and facts.

And so for them a routine is going to be really important. And so what I find is understanding these traits.

And you know, you might have a kid who is an I and an S and then also some C, you know, so when you understand that, then you do have a.

You have a way of being able to connect with them, understand their needs, their emotional needs, their social needs, and then be able to communicate with them in a way that best suits them and understanding yourself like, what, why am I being triggered by this behavior? And when you don't understand what is underlying the behavior that we tend to be offended.

And so I just feel like it opens up a whole new world of like, understanding dynamics and interactions and what their needs are and how we can best meet them while understanding what drives our behavior too. So I don't know if that answered your question or not, but, you know, I just really.

Herb: 00:25:54

There's sometimes this, this pushback when you talk about having kids, personality tested, about pigeonholing them.

Kristina: 00:26:01

So labeling, labeling. Oh, this is all you expect of them now?

Herb: 00:26:05

It's like, no, that's just the baseline. So, So I, I remember taking the disc in, in other things earlier in, in my life.

But it wasn't until later where I was starting to have some issues when I hurt my head, that I got into the mbti, the Meyer Briggs Type index.

Mindy Green: 00:26:24

Yes.

Herb: 00:26:24

And when I really looked into that and I dug deeper than just the oh, I'm an infj and what does that mean? And I really got to looking stacks and how those different things work.

It's like, oh, wow, this explains so much of how I handled problems of what I went through. It's not who I am. It just is like, this is under a default conditions.

This is how you're going to come out a problem and this is how you're going to work through to get to your solution based on the way your brain tries to work. So when I got involved in that, you know, then I looked into the Enneagram. There's.

There's so many other different types of personality tests and they're all a little different, but it's amazing also how accurate they were in help.

And it brought me to a place of more calmness, of acceptance of who I was, because the way I am in some ways made me feel like I was wrong about something or that, that I'm not, because, hey, that person's like that. I should be like that. And that would make me feel less than.

And so once I learned about that, then, you know, we, I'm a big proponent of finding this stuff out for your children. And again, not to pigeonhole them, but to get an idea of where they're at.

And I say that they, that once they understand their personality, then they start using their personality to build their character and characters is who they are as they go through life.

And so I came at that kind of weird and crooked because we have gotten a lot of pushback and it's like, oh, but you're going to label them, you're going to pigeonhole them and then you're not going to. Because if they're introverted, you're not going to expect them to get out in front of people.

It's like, no, you realize that introversion is their strength and that's where they get their energy back from being alone and working through some of their internal stuff. And then they have the energy to go out and build their extroverted character, even though that's not their necessarily personality. So. Sorry.

I like the way, you know, I know it was going to make you laugh, but, but so sometimes when we start talking about personalities with children, people get a little on the touchy side.

Mindy Green: 00:28:41

Well, and I like though, and I appreciate you sharing that perspective because I think it is important for, for parents to understand that it isn't just a, you know, it's not Pigeonholing them or labeling them, it's just giving you a foundational understanding of who they are in certain circumstances. And I'll say, I'll speak to the introversion. I'm an introvert. And it also, what I see is, and I, and two of my kids are introverts as well.

And what I see is that it really helps them to understand. It's like a filter for them.

And so they feel better around certain people, you know, and it's understanding their personalities, those people's personalities as well, and how they respond to different things. And so there are some people who are more energy giving and therapy and then there are people who aren't as much.

So it helps them to be able to stand, understand who they, who they feel good around.

And so in terms of friendships and things, you know, it's like they might want to spend more time with certain people because they're not, they don't draw as much energy, if that makes sense. And so it's helpful like in just those relationships. And we sometimes say opposites attract. And that is true in certain ways, you know.

So for my one daughter who is very introverted, she has a husband. I think if she had an extroverted husband, then that would be really draining for her and I think it would be sometimes a cause for some tension.

And so he's, he's a little bit more extroverted than she is. At the same time, he's not what I would call a real extrovert. And so it just gives them some insights into how they function best, where they thrive.

And I really love that about these insights. And I will say about disc, a lot of times we've heard about DISC specifically in business and that's how it started.

And I have worked with a coach now for the past three years and she actually reached out to one of the companies that sells Desk and they went through, they completely remodeled it or not remodeled, redesigned is the word, so that it does look at these familial relationships. And so that's really nice because then you're getting specific information about how you can use this in your family. Like what?

And it's very strengths based, you know, so seeing your extroversion or your introversion as a strength and you know, what is your pace and, and how you can, if you're, if you're a high D, how can you then work with someone who is, is an, is an ass? You know, they just want everybody to get along.

And so, you know, you can, you can look at how you're communicating then it's just, it's so rich, as I said, and just the insights that it can bring into any of your relationships and into yourself so that you can have more self compassion.

Herb: 00:31:47

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. That's what I found out. Self compassion. And while it didn't say, hey, this is, this is how Herb is. Because, you know, I'm quite unique.

I'm quite unique. But it, when I hook up with other people who fit in my same personality type, they're not me, they're.

They don't have my experiences, they don't, they are their own characters.

And it's like I, sometimes it's really difficult for me to be around other infjs because it's like, oh, wow, they're not, they're like me, but they're not like me. And so it's, it's really interesting. So again, it's not a pigeonhole, it's not a label. It.

It's just a tool to help understand how you make decisions, how you choose what's going to happen, how if you don't choose what's going to happen. Because of default modes.

Yeah, it's just they are amazing tools and for kids, they're awful, or at least it was for me, like having to try and figure all that stuff out. And it also does change. So children don't have quite as many personality traits, so it's at a smaller level.

And then as they get older, as their brains develop and more of these, then more of these, these traits actually do develop. So lot, lots of, lots of information there.

And so thank you very much for touching that and bringing that to us because it's better than hearing it just from me.

Kristina: 00:33:12

So when you're working with a family, do you actually go deep into explaining the different profiles and stuff to the parents for the children, or do you actually go and explain it like to the children so they can understand it? How do you kind of work into the family?

Mindy Green: 00:33:26

So when I'm working with a family, what I do is I have them take the assessments. And so children, even as young as four, can take it. And what they do is for that assessment they use pictures.

And so it's there, it's them interpreting what they're seeing in the picture. And that gives insights into what their personality traits may be. And so it's just, it's really fascinating.

And then I have the parents take it as well.

And so then what we do is we have a call to then go through it and I can plug in the Parents personality and the child's personality, and then we'll see. So individually, this is what, what you might be working with. And, you know, and then these might be some areas that, that you want to work on.

You know, so again, I, I use the high D, but it could also be that you have a very cautious parent and they have a very inspiring type child, you know, and so some of the signs they're dealing with that impulsivity that, you know, very high energy. And so it's just working through those dynamics.

And so we go through the assessments, and then I have a program that they can take called the Parenting Blueprint, which guides them through communication and the dynamics and how to meet emotional needs. And it's just, it's fabulous because they gain a lot of practical tips along the way and get to play around with them and see what works for their.

For their family.

Kristina: 00:34:56

Yeah. And I can really see how, you know, if you're a parent who has to have your child in public school, you're not around them quite as much.

This is still going to be super, super helpful. Right. Because when they are around you, you get to really communicate.

But if you're in that homeschool situation where you're around them basically 24 7, you're going to want this higher level of communication, this higher level of connection, this higher level of understanding each other so that the family flows and smooth and flows and moves easily. There we go.

Mindy Green: 00:35:28

Yeah.

Kristina: 00:35:31

Okay. Tongue tied there.

But, yeah, so, because that's one of the things that, you know, our parents say is like, I can't imagine being around my kids basically 24 7. Right. And again, it goes back to, do you really connect with them? Do you really communicate with them?

Do you really understand them so that you can make that happen? Yeah.

Mindy Green: 00:35:52

Well, and I think, too, that there's a misconception that we are around our kids 247 when we homeschool and you're really not. And I'll say this because, you know, there are times that they're working independently and they also have their own interests.

So my younger daughter started an internship. She started volunteering at the library when she was in ninth grade. And so, you know, she was gone for those three or four hours.

And, you know, my oldest daughter did, when she was a junior in high school, decide that she wanted to go to high school. And so I gave her that opportunity. So she did. She did go to high school full time her junior and senior year.

And so, you know, it was nice, though, that I had this opportunity to know who she was, you know, because we had spent time together, you know, so that when she made that transition that I knew how to support her with, with this whole new world that was being opened up to her.

Kristina: 00:36:47

Right.

Mindy Green: 00:36:48

You know, and they all started taking classes.

Herb: 00:36:50

What were some of the things that you noticed about when she did go back to school? Did she talk about that? What about, did she talk about how the children at school were different and how did she handle things differently?

What, what was her experience of homeschooling and then going into the public education system?

Mindy Green: 00:37:09

So at the time she wouldn't have said this, but in more recent years she has said that it was like unfocused chaos.

Kristina: 00:37:17

Yeah.

Herb: 00:37:17

Talk about that.

Mindy Green: 00:37:19

Yes. And. And one of the things that she did say though is that.

And she was in higher level classes and one of the things that she said is that she's glad that she was in those particular classes because there was more focus and.

Kristina: 00:37:35

Yeah.

Mindy Green: 00:37:35

And more support and you know, she. Because some of the kids who were in the. In the diff.

Other classes were struggling, you know, because there was a lot of, a lot of talking and a lot of just interruptions and things like that. So you didn't really get a chance. The opportunity to really pay attention to things.

And you know, so at least I think in the classes that she took, she felt like she was getting the support. You know, the pace was very different because.

And that's one thing I'll say in our, in our here at home, you know, I would give them extra time because it was important to me for them to understand the material. So if it took rather than two days, it took a week.

I wasn't concerned about that because it was really, for me it was all about them understanding and playing around with the content and the material and really. And really being able to grasp it rather than just sitting fitting into a timeline.

So I will say that that's one where one way that she struggled because, you know, there were, there were firm deadlines and rightfully so. And I do understand that, you know, and I would say that that wasn't something that I was as good at enforcing at home.

And so I would say one thing to the audience that if you can, if you are homeschooling, to make sure that you have a firm deadline if you want them to have a paper in by a certain time, because that's really a good life skill for them to have, especially if they choose to go to college or they're going to take, you know, other courses.

You know, whether it's like a, you know, a vocational training or whatever, that there will be deadlines that they have to face that are, that are not going to be negotiable.

Kristina: 00:39:14

Yeah, that's interesting. Yeah.

And because actually I talked with another mom this morning, get to know you call and she said the same thing that whenever her children decided they actually wanted to go back to school, you know, kind of thing. And so it's. But it's. She dealt with it as like, oh, I'm a failure because my kids want to go back to school kind of thing.

But it was some one of those things that they really had to work as a family and figure out what why was, you know, was it a timing thing, was it a expense thing, was it a different kind of learning need kind of thing? So, you know, it's not something that is a failure. Right.

If you are homeschooling and then your children go back to school or they're at school and then they come home is that people have to remember not to look at these things as failures. It's like what's best for your child, what's best for your family and how you can support that all together.

Mindy Green: 00:40:06

And I think it's really exploring, if we talk about wanting our kids to, to love learning, it's exploring different styles. And I, Herb, you had mentioned it in the beginning, like, just about like the, the teaching style. And so I have a very specific style.

And so for my oldest daughter, she wanted to have more hands on and she really wanted. Because one of the things that she was trying to do is she wanted to get into a high, higher tiered college.

And so she wanted to be able to focus on expanding her, the, her exposure to different types of teaching. And so that was really helpful for her.

And you know, I then I have my oldest son, my third child, he took a couple of courses at our local community college when he was a junior and senior.

And that was because there were specific things that I could, you know, even though he created a couple of his own courses, I really felt like it would be good for him to have that opportunity. And he was all about that, you know, so he took a couple of courses and really enjoyed that.

And it gave him confidence and it gave my daughter confidence as well that, hey, we're learning, you know, in these different environments and we're doing really well. So it gave them the boost that they needed to know that they could, they could, you know, learn wherever they are.

Kristina: 00:41:27

Yeah, that's. And that's amazing. That is great message to be able to give you your children or have your children realize that. Yeah. What.

You know, even though their learning might look a little bit different, they're still learning so much that they're going to be successful in all these different areas.

Herb: 00:41:41

Yeah. And right now, colleges are actually recruiting more heavily from, from homeschooled children because they are more independent.

They don't have to be coddled as much as a lot of the kids coming out of high school.

They are able to think for themselves and articulate and, and so colleges are realizing that their homeschooled children are more likely to graduate and do well and need less handling from, from the staff because they are more independent.

They are, they do have that sense of responsibility because they've been doing it for themselves for quite a while and they also have that love of learning usually. So, yeah, right now homeschooled children have an easier time getting into college.

Mindy Green: 00:42:29

Yes. And I can say, having had three of my four children in college, that they really.

I was, I was positively, I was going to say positively impressed, but that's not quite the right wording for it, but I was, I was impressed with, with the application process, how easily they made it for a homeschooling child to be able to, to go through that process.

You know, so both, all three of my children who did go to college were able to, you know, participate in their scholarship competitions and they won scholarships for that. And, you know, so they, I don't think that it was a hindrance to them at all.

And they were able to write really great essays and you know, they, they were able to present themselves well in interviews because they, you know, these were things, they were in conversation with adults all the time. You know, so I really. And they, you know, multilevel learning. And there were just so many positives, so many benefits to that.

And, and so the colleges made that, that process very easy for me too, because I was putting all that together.

Kristina: 00:43:42

Right, exactly.

Herb: 00:43:43

Conversations with adults and making that easier to get through college. So that's another one of these myths that people have is, oh, my homeschool kids won't be properly socialized.

They won't have to go through that trauma inducing chaos of being picked on and bullied and 15 minutes of hall time where they're pushed into their lockers. You know, my most traumatic memories are from high school. And so how does that turn into a properly socialized kid?

Whereas your homeschool children are talking with adults all the time. They're going out and they're working at the library. She probably got that herself. You didn't have to go force her into that.

Your, your junior in high school decided to go to college and take classes on his own.

And so there are so many different types of socialization that happen through homeschooling because they're in a, in a more of a cooperative environment than they are in a competitive environment. So let's go there a little bit because I noticed you went like this when I first started talking about.

Kristina: 00:44:47

Yeah. Holding her head in her hands for our listening only audience.

Herb: 00:44:52

And, and as, as a, as a school counselor, school social worker, I'm sure you saw the socialization horrors firsthand at school.

Mindy Green: 00:45:02

Well, I think it goes back to what do we consider socialization? So do you have to only socialize with kids your own age? And I would say no.

And I don't think that it's always a good idea to only have friends or, you know, be around kids your own age all the time. As an adult, you're not going to be around people who are your exact age, you know, in your job, in your, you know, in your everyday interactions.

So I think it's a benefit to our kids to expose them to different age groups. And socialization, I'll say, for my family was not the difficult difficulty.

There are so many great opportunities and more and more now than even when my kids were growing up, you know, there it was hard to stay at home and actually do some of our written work or our book work because we were. There were so many great things outside of home.

And so that was a balance that we really had to work on because, you know, my kids were really great at socializing and they still are. And I'll just say, if you're concerned about your kids being socialized, you know, so my oldest daughter is an office manager.

My younger daughter is an assistant branch manager for her life for the Live, one of our libraries here in our county. You know, my other son is a physical therapist.

And, you know, my youngest son is in a master's program getting his degree in count, his advanced degree in counseling. So, you know, we think about socialization in terms of helping our kids to be successful.

And so, you know, I think sometimes we need to reexamine that, you know, about what we want them to be successful at.

You know, my kids are really good, and, you know, many of the homeschool families that I know and that we interacted with, their kids are really good at talking to other adults. And, you know, I know in public school, when or in the public educational setting, sometimes the kids don't know how to talk to adults.

They don't know how to make eye contact, they don't know how to ask questions, they don't know how to follow up with asking what comes next. And so there are gaps in their ability to socialize with people of different age groups.

Kristina: 00:47:28

Absolutely. Yeah.

Thank you for saying that because that's, that's one of those things just blows our mind when our, when, you know, we go on a podcast or something, we talk to other people like, well, what about that whole socialization thing? And we come back with an answer very similar to what you just said, because we just know it, it's not really an issue.

It's just one of those pretend myth things that make it so that parents don't want to do this. So they're afraid they're going to mess up their kids.

Herb: 00:47:53

And, and a lot of homeschoolers, they get their physical activities outside, they'll take their kids a dance, to swimming, to sports and when they're, and so instead of like, or music, so music in school, typically you go to a class to, you go to a music class with the kids in your class and it's half an hour or 40 minutes or whatever, and it's just your same kids. You take your kids to a music class outside of school. Then there's children of all ages, sometimes adults, all in that class learning music together.

And they get to see how different people do it and they get to interact with different people and get help from different age people along.

So, yeah, there's so many more opportunities for, I would say, proper healthy socialization than just within your specific age group of people at your own maturity level. So as you're working with people of different maturity levels, it's like, oh, I want to be more mature like that. Ooh, I want to have that.

So there's, there's more ability to, to start building your character by finding things that you admire in different age groups.

Mindy Green: 00:49:00

Well, and I will say too that I think that sometimes what happens is when we have our kids in same aged groups that there's even a variation there too. So you have the kids who, who are more mature and you know and think a little bit differently and they don't always feel like they fit in.

And so I think that everybody is scrambling even in those age groups to figure out where they bel. Belong and how they fit.

And so, and it's, you know, the societal norms that we have around socialization makes it very difficult for our kids to feel like they fit in and to know where they belong. And these are conversations that we can have with our kids when we do have, when we are having them at home and educating at home, because they can.

And again, like I said about introverts and extroverts and it's, you know, and having some knowledge of their own personalities and what they really enjoy and what they don't enjoy. It's like they're learning all of that, and they get to do it in a safe environment where it's not like, what is it the crabs like, they.

Sometimes we use the example of crabs in a bucket and you have a crab that's trying to get out and they're being pulled back down by the other crabs, you know, and I think that sometimes when we, when kids are in school, you know, that that's something that happens because, you know, if you are someone who really excels at something, it's not always looked upon as favor looked upon favorably, you know, because. And kids are being taught that it's best not to stand out.

Kristina: 00:50:37

And we don't want that. We want them leaving school, leaving their education confident with that love of learning and knowing who they are. Right.

And, you know, if we go back to the college thing is what those who want to go to college. Well, homeschool kids have had a chance to explore lots of different things, so they know usually what they're going to do when they get there.

So there's not this exploring and adding a fifth year or adding extra time because, oh, I was doing this degree and now I'm switching over to this degree kind of thing. They go in a little more grounded and ready to take on that challenge of what they really, really want to do.

Mindy Green: 00:51:13

I agree with you. Yes. And I. And I think too, that they, like you said, they have a chance to explore.

And, you know, this is where we have the opportunity as homeschool parents or home educators to really look at, you know, giving our kids the tools that they need to be able to thrive, you know, because we're focusing on. On their futures and giving them stable stability now so that they can.

They can grow and develop, you know, and learn and in a healthy, safe environment.

Herb: 00:51:46

So going back just a little bit, I also like the monkey in the ladder study that they did as well as the crab bucket. So this is.

They put a bunch of bananas at the top of a ladder and they had a room full of monkeys, and a monkey would go up to try and get a banana and they would Spray freezing water on all of the monkeys. And they kept doing that. And then eventually they would bring in. And so all the monkeys stopped going up the ladder to get the banana.

And then they would bring in a new monkey, and the new monkey would see that banana up on the ladder and would go for the ladder.

And all the other monkeys would beat that monkey up and they would slowly swap out all of the monkeys so that none of the monkeys that had ever been sprayed with water were in that group.

But anytime they brought in a new monkey that headed for the ladder, all of the monkeys that were used to beating up monkeys going for that ladder would beat up the monkeys.

So it got to the point where none of them had the original experience of being sprayed with cold water, but they were all still not letting anybody go up that ladder.

Mindy Green: 00:52:47

Wow.

Herb: 00:52:47

And so that. That's also pretty accurate in what the school system. It's been around for 60 years. It's like they're not doing anything different that our.

Our parents was like, oh, but I went to school. This is what it was like when I went to school. So you have to go to school. And so that whole whole having to fit in and not go up that ladder to.

To reach that goal is very prevalent in our school system, as well as the crab pot where they just out of habit, it's like, oh, there's somebody going up. I'm going to try and get up there and use them to pull them down. So two different ways of looking at it, but they're both very.

Both very poignant to what's going on.

Mindy Green: 00:53:27

Yes. And I've never heard about the monkey on the ladder. And I. That I think that's a fabulous analogy for our study to show what can happen.

And I think how sad too, That's. That's what's happening and we're seeing it in our world.

Kristina: 00:53:42

Yeah.

But that's the beauty of having people like you come and coach families and show some and inspire them to do something a little bit different with their family, try something new, communicate better. That's the beauty of having us as parents, as coaches as well, helping families.

Look at the education just a little bit different ways, like what is possible and what do we really want for our children? So thank you for doing your work so that families can communicate and work better together and everything.

Mindy Green: 00:54:10

Absolutely. And I.

I just want to say too, for the parents who might be listening and you might not be even are considering homeschooling right now, you know, that's not to say that what we've talked about with public education that you can't make a difference, you know, and I think that that's where the work that we do is as parent coaches comes in handy because you can have great, your kids can have great experiences. And I think it starts at home.

And the way that we interact with them, the way that we prepare them and give them, you know, these skills to be resilient and, you know, and to be able to discuss with them what is going on. So if you're in a place where you feel like you can't homeschool, know that you can still make a huge difference with your kids.

And it's all about being heartfelt and really wanting to connect with them on a deeper level.

Herb: 00:55:02

Yep. The greatest indicator for children's success, whether they're homeschooled or public school, is their parents involvement in their education. Yes.

Be involved. If they're at school, don't just, oh, how was your school day? It's like, get involved, pay attention. Go to the school events. It's like that.

Being mindful of your children's education and actually showing an interest in it is really the greatest asset your children can have. So even if they are in public school, even if they are homeschooled, be there for them. Advocate, be involved.

Kristina: 00:55:37

Absolutely. So, Mindy, make sure you tell our audience a little bit of how they can get a hold of you if they want to work with you, things like that.

Where can they find you? And yeah, all that.

Mindy Green: 00:55:49

Yeah. So please, if you have enjoyed what you've been hearing and want to know a little bit more, you can find me@mindygreencoaching.com that's my website.

And there's, you know, there's plenty of free resources there and a way that you can connect with me to get more information. You can also find me on Facebook. I have a page there. Mindy Green coaching. I'm on LinkedIn. I'm on Instagram, and it's all, all Mindy Green Coaching.

And I would love to have you just reach out to me and let me see how I might be able to help you and support you along this path. Excellent.

Kristina: 00:56:25

Thank you so much.

And of course, those links and things will also be in our show notes, but we always like to just say it out loud for those people are just kind of listening in. So thank you so very, very much and thank you for being here. I think this has been a wonderful discussion.

I love how we wrapped it around your experience with your children. But then also, you know, this experience. You're giving families now that communication and that connection that's so very, very vital.

So thank you for sharing all of that with us.

Mindy Green: 00:56:49

Thank you so much for having me.

Herb: 00:56:52

It has been a pleasure having you on today. Your humor, your smile is just lights up the room.

I love how you were able to bring in personality because we haven't really had many guests who talk about that so very much. And it's just been a pleasure talking with you. So thank you very much for being here. Thank you for sharing your story.

Thank you for, for being out there.

Mindy Green: 00:57:13

I appreciate you both.

Kristina: 00:57:15

All right, audience, that is it for today. Thank you for joining us and sharing in this information. Take these gold nuggets.

There have been lots of things dropped in this episode that will help you out. Just little small things that you can take an institute in your family and help your children be happy, healthy and successful into the future.

Until next time. Bye for now.

Herb: 00:57:34

Bye for now.